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Post by kittylady on Aug 16, 2022 23:09:32 GMT
Based on personal experiences I don't have a lot of fondness for the Catholic church anyway but I feel that sustaining a body when there is no chance of meaningful recovery (or any recovery at all) is both cruel and undignified. In Terry Shiavo's case if life sustaining medical intervention hadn't taken place following resuscitation she would have died so to me the unnatural part was tube feeding an all but vacant body for years. Science was interfering with "God's Plan". Anyway, back to Anne. I hope that the organ donations are a success and that she is/was able to play a part in giving quality of life and hope to many others. There has to be some good to come out of the sadness. I'm not overly fond of much of what the Church is, so to speak. I have HUGE issues with their marginalization of people, their handling of the sexual abuse of children, etc. etc. Here's a perfect example; my MIL was not married in the Church and her husband was previously married. She spent 30 years of Sundays going to Mass and denied Communion. I would ask her, "Why are you going somewhere you are only peripherally wanted?" This was me also. My husband was previously married in the church so I wasn't allowed to take Communion. However, the current pope ended that restriction a few years ago and I'm now allowed to take Communion. Its entirely man made dogma. That is just another example. I'm not overly fond of much of what the Church is, so to speak. I have HUGE issues with their marginalization of people, their handling of the sexual abuse of children, etc. etc. Here's a perfect example; my MIL was not married in the Church and her husband was previously married. She spent 30 years of Sundays going to Mass and denied Communion. I would ask her, "Why are you going somewhere you are only peripherally wanted?" My Dad wasn't a practicing Catholic, and after he died the nuns told me that because he never went to church, he was in purgatory and would stay there my entire lifetime and longer unless I prayed hard. I was 12. I became a fully-fledged non-believer soon after. A few things did it for me. My sperm donor is Catholic and Ma Kitty was baptised as a Wesleyan Methodist (although I'd describe her as Atheist now). When they married my paternal Grandmother had the priest visit every few months to pressure Ma Kitty to convert and be 'properly married in God's eyes' in a Catholic ceremony as they'd married in the local Methodist Church. When she announced that she was expecting my older brother the visits from the priest became a weekly event where she was threatened with hellfire and denounced for intending to bring a "bastard" into the world. After that she told him to go forth and multiply and stopped answering the door, but it didn't stop them trying again when she was carrying me. Then when she filed for divorce from the sperm donor the visits started again, this time to demand that she be a good, loyal and humble wife who should forgive her abusive, unfaithful husband and call off the divorce. She asked how she was supposed to call off a divorce from a man that they kept insisting she wasn't actually married to and slammed the door in the priest's face. The sperm donor married a Good Catholic Girl shortly after the divorce was finalised (probably to save face seeing as though she got named as the affair partner in the divorce. Ha!) and got to have the full Catholic marriage service with the Mass and all the whistles and bells because in the eyes of the Catholic church he had never been married. Ma Kitty, my brother and I were wiped from history. Another thing that sealed it for me was some Irish Catholic friends of my maternal grandparents. They came over to stay with my grandparents at least once a year and every single day that they were there the mother would take herself off to the nearest Catholic church to go to confession. Why? Because her youngest son had spina bifida and her parish priest had told her that it was God visiting his wrath on her for unknown sins she had committed and not atoned for and that her only hope of seeing her son walk and not die at a tragically young age (as was medically expected) was if she prayed and begged for the Lord's forgiveness for the specific sin that she had committed that had caused it. Her husband didn't get any such treatment. In fact, he was treated as a Godly man for bearing up so well under the burdens his wife's sins had put on him. As young as I was when I found all of this out I decided there and then that it was all bullshit and that I wanted no part of a God who could do this. I have no problem with Catholics in general - so long as they don't try to preach or convert me - and if their faith gives them comfort and joy then good for them. But the church itself? No thanks. |
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trixie
OGs 
stuck in the middle with you...
Posts: 2,105
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Post by trixie on Aug 17, 2022 1:25:54 GMT
She pulled off a lot of different looks over the years, and they all looked good on her.
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Post by charmedhour on Aug 17, 2022 8:41:40 GMT
I'm not overly fond of much of what the Church is, so to speak. I have HUGE issues with their marginalization of people, their handling of the sexual abuse of children, etc. etc. Here's a perfect example; my MIL was not married in the Church and her husband was previously married. She spent 30 years of Sundays going to Mass and denied Communion. I would ask her, "Why are you going somewhere you are only peripherally wanted?" My Dad wasn't a practicing Catholic, and after he died the nuns told me that because he never went to church, he was in purgatory and would stay there my entire lifetime and longer unless I prayed hard. I was 12. I became a fully-fledged non-believer soon after. Best part about Purgatory- it’s a word not mentioned once in the Bible. It’s all passage interpretation from both Old and New Testament. There’s are passages in both that speak of purification of the soul before entrance to Heaven. Paying for Masses to be said in the name of a deceased is purely a Medieval invention and part of the what was viewed as abuses of the Church leading to the Reformation. My late MIL was crazy concerned about Purgatory sadly. We paid for many Masses to be said in her name to cover those bases for her. I always told her I would pray for her- but that she found peace in death that she did not have in life. |
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Post by firebrat1229 on Aug 17, 2022 15:45:06 GMT
Story I heard from my mom - when her MIL (my dad's mom) died of breast cancer in 1971, the priest helpfully told my dad and his two brothers that she, despite being a practicing catholic who went every sunday, could not have a catholic service and burial because..wait for it - their dad (my grandpa and her widower and also purportedly a catholic) had been married before.
Best part? No one knew this.
It's not funny but I laughed out loud at the absurdity of the situation. Apparently it was quite the scandal at the time, though. I felt kinda bad for my dad and uncles in hindsight though, since they knew she would have wanted the catholic service/burial and all that stuff. And they were all mama's boys and were crushed that she had died in her late 50s. So yeah, way to heap on the grief by being a petty little bitch, priest.
And gramps? He was fine - he went on to marry 4 more times (total of 6) after this before dying in the late 1980s. Oof.
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Post by notoriousmkg on Aug 17, 2022 17:59:02 GMT
I'm so sorry all you guys had the hard-ass Catholic clergy. Out here, we had the breakaway, super-liberal parishes that got regular warnings by the Archbishop. You'd get a Catholic burial if you could prove that your relative had attended at least one Christmas or Easter mass in the last 10 years. And could at least name their last three spouses.
We had priests who were more concerned about nuclear weapons proliferation than abortion. In fact, I remember seeing one of them (Father Eugene Brake) on a local news show trying to block the entrance to some military facility.
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Post by dechayz on Aug 17, 2022 20:00:17 GMT
Based on personal experiences I don't have a lot of fondness for the Catholic church anyway but I feel that sustaining a body when there is no chance of meaningful recovery (or any recovery at all) is both cruel and undignified. In Terry Shiavo's case if life sustaining medical intervention hadn't taken place following resuscitation she would have died so to me the unnatural part was tube feeding an all but vacant body for years. Science was interfering with "God's Plan". Anyway, back to Anne. I hope that the organ donations are a success and that she is/was able to play a part in giving quality of life and hope to many others. There has to be some good to come out of the sadness. I'm not overly fond of much of what the Church is, so to speak. I have HUGE issues with their marginalization of people, their handling of the sexual abuse of children, etc. etc. Here's a perfect example; my MIL was not married in the Church and her husband was previously married. She spent 30 years of Sundays going to Mass and denied Communion. I would ask her, "Why are you going somewhere you are only peripherally wanted?" This was me also. My husband was previously married in the church so I wasn't allowed to take Communion. However, the current pope ended that restriction a few years ago and I'm now allowed to take Communion. Its entirely man made dogma. That is just another example. Same here. Priest told my mother unless she had her marriage to my father annulled (this was post-divorce) she could not marry my stepfather in her church. Stepfather is Lutheran and they didn't care so they got married in his church. She still goes to the Catholic church, which is MORE than happy to take her money, but will not allow her communion. I asked her why tf don't you just go to stepdad's church, it's the SAME STUFF but without a pole up its ass about everything. But she's stuck on that "but I was raised Catholic" label  |
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Post by waterslide on Aug 18, 2022 0:46:15 GMT
I'm so sorry all you guys had the hard-ass Catholic clergy. Out here, we had the breakaway, super-liberal parishes that got regular warnings by the Archbishop. You'd get a Catholic burial if you could prove that your relative had attended at least one Christmas or Easter mass in the last 10 years. And could at least name their last three spouses. We had priests who were more concerned about nuclear weapons proliferation than abortion. In fact, I remember seeing one of them (Father Eugene Brake) on a local news show trying to block the entrance to some military facility. I have my issues with the Catholic church, and don't practice it, but what you're describing is more in line with my experiences growing up Catholic. I mean, I'd heard rumors about the stories the rest of you have mentioned, but they were almost on par with urban legend. I'm not saying all that didn't happen, it's just that I was in some kind of weird bubble where I never saw any of it up close. The only story I can think of that I thought was crazy at the time was my friend's mom, who was a widow, trying to marry a divorced man and the Vatican wouldn't grant him an annulment so they got married at a Protestant church, but life went on for them pretty much as normal. And for many years, we had fish on Fridays... |
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Post by notoriousmkg on Aug 18, 2022 2:56:12 GMT
^^^ Right after my last post I remembered that one of my cousins had married a guy who was a former Catholic. I've known him for more than 30 years now, but did not learn until the last few years why he left the church. What happened was that his parents were divorced (dad left the family) and the mom was unable to get communion or something. So, basically punishing and stigmatizing a woman and innocent child over something someone else did.
Lately, I have been boycotting going to Mass. And basically, it's due to the USSC decision, which the Catholic Church has been beating the drum for for decades now. It's sad, because I really liked the pastor of our church. He is a really positive, charismatic guy who never mentions abortion during mass. That kind of stuff is painful.
The other thing that has driven me kind of crazy about the Cburch is the invention of dogma along the way. I get that they will reaffirm principles about issues along the way as various political movements come up. A great example is Pope Leo's "Rerum Novarum" encyclical in 1891, which was basically in reaction to the rise of communism and socialism. It asserted the right to private property, but also supported the rights of labor (to form unions) and criticized the extremes of communism and capitalism.
But lately, I think that the abortion issue was really more of a ploy by the Church to try to hold Catholics together by uniting them around a common cause. That being said, their focus on the issue eclipsed all the other stuff they had been known for - antiwar, anti-weapons of mass destruction, anti capital punishment. And even worse, basically ignoring climate change as an issue that will negatively affect literally hundreds of millions of people. If that isn't the defining moral issue of our time, I don't know what the f*ck is.
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trixie
OGs
stuck in the middle with you...
Posts: 2,105
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Post by trixie on Aug 18, 2022 3:41:47 GMT
I have a friend who is Catholic. #1 marriage was in the Catholic church, even though he wasn't Catholic. Moving on to #2, they were both Catholic but of course couldn't get married in the church because of her divorce. She talked about annulment which I thought was ridiculous (they were married several years and had a child). She told me, well if I get married again outside of the Catholic church I can never take communion again. I said oh it's ok if you live together but once you're married you can't. She said well the priest doesn't know we live together and I said, yeah but GOD does. That conversation told me all I needed to know about the Catholic church.
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Post by mrsfawlty on Aug 18, 2022 10:16:20 GMT
I worked in a stroke rehabilitation ward during my training. There was a rather handsome Catholic priest who used to visit a couple of the patients, on Sundays, and we'd gather them in a designated room for communion. Anywhoo, he stopped calling after a few weeks, so I asked the patients if he'd been moved to another parish. No, he hadn't moved but he'd got a woman pregnant and was thrown out of the church, as a result! One of the patients then piped up and said......"They should have kept him on, at least the choir boys would have been safe!"
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Post by waterslide on Sept 1, 2022 2:40:09 GMT
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Post by MsDark on Sept 1, 2022 3:42:39 GMT
Lawd I hope she doesn't have any parents still alive or other trifling family members coming out of the woodwork.
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Post by waterslide on Sept 1, 2022 5:18:55 GMT
Lawd I hope she doesn't have any parents still alive or other trifling family members coming out of the woodwork. Oh yeah, she's got her cunt of a mother and a sister who owns a jewelry shop somewhere a bit north from where I am (actually in Michigan). The pic of her mom and sister are in the lower right of this obnoxiously big pic.  I'm not sure what the purpose is of making the elder brother be guardian ad litem, but the only experience I have with GaLs is through foster care and they kind of act as a buffer so that there is someone to act in the child's best interests and also to kind of guide, in my example, children through legal and court processes. And I thought they were usually appointed or had no interest in the filing. I guess it's just so the brother could be added to the court documents as a minor? Isn't the same as an appropriate adult in the UK? |
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Post by Taniwha on Sept 1, 2022 13:26:31 GMT
I get angry when people with children don’t have wills.
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Post by czb on Sept 1, 2022 15:09:15 GMT
how much of her estate will be left after she is sued for all the damage to that woman's house??
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